Polymeric sand, in the case of larger jointsis just even more likely to fail. Call your local quarry. Some pieces are 2 thick x 12 long by 4 widesome are 3/4 to 1 thick 1010 size, with only a handful ideal size pieces to keep it anchored together, i suppose. Another method is to simply pour boiling water on the unwanted plants. I have a dry laid flagstone patio in the backyard, and am exploring some joint filler options. Shady area you say? Joints are aging well. I might get a bag and experiment with a small section, maybe at the start of the driveway. Like a branching sort of design or meandering stream-like pattern. Couldn't other binding agents like lime/ash or cement be used? work the soil to a depth of approximately 5 to 6 inches, How To Keep Gravel In Place In A Driveway. We have worked with a company in Western PA called Harsco Minerals which has a product called Mineral CSA (formerly known as REC MIX) which we have used as a pond liner for treating mine drainage. They dont bother our river rocks by the pond but those are fairly large. Gravel-Lok, also known as "Gravel Glue" is a Polyurethane-based resin which when binds stones together when applied. 3. Maybe some other kind of inexpensive metal grating would also work. Perhaps some mix of local materials may work, but it all depends on what materials are available and what color pallet we are working with. Good luck with your flagstone project! If I keep the joints tight will the material bind enough to keep water from percolating into ground? )and get as many of them clean as possible, knowing that a few of them you may have to replace, a few maybe get turned upside down and re-puzzled in to the project, maybe leave one stone still with the haze, as part of the patio forever, to always remind you of this fun adventure. Once the gravel is completely loose and all objects removed, it should be tamped down using either a hand tamper . How to screen this back porch? Have returned to this post many times. If it works, let me know! I use, and recommend a stone dust joint, for dry laid flagstone applications. This year we had the finances to redo it (had our concrete co. remove it) with Connecticut Bluestone slate. I also like your stand on being paid for your knowledge and experience. Im in Tucson AZ and have a very large flagstone patio that is 15 yrs old and is showing many cracks in the mortar grout. Great work, youve inspired another. Location: New England. Im hoping you might recommend something. Then, pour about three inches of pea gravel on top of this base layer. When using pea gravel for a hard surface patio or similar area, you need to use a binding solution. I would of course not recommend it, for reasons outlined in the article above.well, it wouldnt be my first recommendation anyway. Ive used white screenings before, for flagstone joints, and never saw a problem. Though it may require some maintenance, down the road. Calcium chloride or other salt substitute should be fine, but salt will deteriorate mortar. As far as separation along the cracks goesthis is a matter of technique, not of product. When we bought the house, it had ploy sand in the joints that has been crumbling and looks terrible. Our monsoon rains also might wash it out. Sigh! You are building a flagstone patiojust use stone. Replace joint material with a mix of topsoil and gravel or stone dust. Am I correct in assuming that I can use this also to level out some stones? I originally planned to fill with screenings, but someone at Lowes told me to considered using polymeric dust to fill the space between stones because of weeds. In warmer places, a 3 to 4 inch gravel base is more common. Hi Devin Thanks for all your comments. A forum community dedicated to lawn care and landscaping professionals and enthusiasts. Great article and Q&As! Id just power wash the whole thing., some joint material may bust loose just from the water.Then Id take a large flathead screwdriver and start prying out joint material. The only problem with dust is the stairs on the outside (front) edge of the stairs. Very informative articles. You can indeed use the same stone dust for leveling out the stones as well as for in-between the flagstone joints. If the patio is dry laid, on a sand/gravel or stone dust foundation..then theres should not be anything portland cement based in the joints. It just dissuaded me from polymeric sand. Assuming that the foundation is gravel. which probably dates to when the house was built(1968). Chances are, they used a grout bag and soupy mortar mix.or just tuck pointed with somewhat wet mortar and didnt clean it up sufficiently while it was wet. Its liquid plastic, alright. After the pea gravel has been dry for at least three days, follow the manufacturers directions to mix the binding solution. You may be familiar with it as a stomach medicine. Make sure to wear rubber gloves for protection. What did I do wrong? Spread sand over the surface of the concrete and pea gravel. If the foundation is dry laid, repair using dry laid methods/if the foundation is cement based, repair with cementious materials. Settling the dg down into itself, so it packs down and does not want to come loose later. 2.5 inches over a ten foot span will be enough, provided there are no major dips. I just put down some pea gravel around my fire pit area and now anytime someone walks on it the gravel gets into the mulch and all over. Again, elbow grease. Well, i figured pavers are just big stones, and it works for them. But the mortar beneath the stones will likely crack, making wobbly stones sitting on cracked hard cement. JavaScript is disabled. Polyurethane coatings. Yes I have run experiments oin differenat areas of the patio and have used different amts of water with the same results. !Thanks in advanceMurphy. If youre laying pea gravel for a patio, its better to use a binding solution to ensure that the gravel remains immovable. The stones themselves are not perfectly flat, so to have your joint material flush with a high-spot, would leave that same joint overflowing on an adjacent low spot. -moss. Natural flagstone, concrete paver and ceramic brick patios and walkways are set upon gravel foundations, their joints then need to be filled. But I would toss it together with stone dust, mixing the two, and consider it an acceptable joint material, so lang as its at least half stone dust/screenings and so long as its mixed fairly well. Thank you for the great tip! Get the cement to a dry-sish mashed potato-like consistency and fill the joint, pressing down firmly. My contractor is out of business so I cant even get hold of him. In a few places where pressure washing has removed the soil, I filled the joints with the rock screening you recommend. Am looking for the classic very light grey or whitewash joint color. Thank you for bringing that updecomposed granite is yet another name for stone dust. My dry laid process is described here. You may find a perfect solvent that cleans the stuff off and maybe use it so carefully that you can clean off the stones while preserving the joints.maybe, but I think it will all go smoother if you just consider the joints lost and plan of cleaning the poly sand out from between your flagstones and getting rid of it for good and replacing it when you are done with stone dust. Do you have any photos of the little piles? Would you suggest minus (I believe here in eastern Mo. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. While drying occurs, do not allow anyone to step on the pea gravel. We did buy poly sand, but can exchange it for the screening. Thank you and good luck . Dig, then tamp, then lay roadbase gravel (3/4 minus). Also do you use stone enhancer to intensify the color of the flag stone? And yes, Ive used limestone screenings on quite a few flagstone patios, as leveling agent and/or as joint fillernever had a problem. 1. Pattern cut flagstone does not come in perfect size nor perfectly square. Devin, What a great article. In the shady area moss will grow in the screenings, in the sunny area, maybe not so much. Then allow it to dry for another 24 hours. It would drain away but I assume some of it may get tracked into the pool. Its an 8 long stone, so now its sitting 2 high. Make your joints tighter. Wow, thats frustrating. It absolutely does seem counter-intuitive to introduce plastic to a landscape; thanks for articulating this so well. Compare. I have a small home-based dog boarding business and it works great. Id go with the stone dust/decomposed granite. Stays slightly flexible so it doesnt crack ((yes.it cracks, sometimes)). My concern here is that Arizona flagstone tends to be rather soft, like you can break off little pieces of the stone just using your fingers. I suppose that may be the same thing as mortar mix, but I'm not sure. Material cost is more or less of no importance so if decomposed granite would work better or look better than other stone dust I would use it. Scrub with the broom a bitthen hose off. Sorry, this website is all about natural stone. Theyll sell it in the masonry section at depot/lowes. It is also nice to know you are willing to travel if I have a job in the future that meets your criteria! Expect to be topping off the stone dust trenches a couple times a year, first year or 2. This was done to lower costs, and because the pond area wouldnt receive heavy foot traffic (so we werent worrying about people kicking the stone dust out with their shoes) and also because we wanted a looser look, around the pond. Stone screenings will contain 1/8 inch to 1/16th inch small chips of stone, like large sized sand, and fines, which will be like flour. You can make plastic from plants.and that may be less toxic and better for our eco system, than petrol-plastic. Sand is generally a poor choice for underneath flagstone. Once it dries has totally different feel (much harder overall) but the surface still has some give to it, Landscape Architects & Landscape Designers, Outdoor Lighting & Audio/Visual Specialists. However, applying these types of products can reduce the permeability of pea gravel. Some people try and solve this problem with plastic edging. (Note: I am not a professional, but love to DYI landscape). Quikrete Assorted All-Purpose Gravel 50 lb. The first thing I want to do is find a way to make it less sloped. And thank you Good luck with your flagstone project! But d-limonene does dissolve a few types of plastic, so I am thinking that d-limonene with a wire-brush just might do the trick. Quick question: in cases where the polymeric sand has left a white haze on the slate as you mentioned, what is the best way to remove the haze? But I couldn't find it in Utah, and I also read that it sticks to your shoes and becomes a sanding agent if you have wood floors, which I do. Good. Solutionfit tighter and fill with larger sized material. I just saw them at the rock yard and thought they looked attractive because of the effect the tumbling had on them. https://www.devineescapes.com/flagstone-what-to-use-sand-cement-or-gravel/. I am totally on board with between the cracks, but should I insist on the bed as well? DIY flagstone advice from a guy at Lowessounds dangerous. He used a crusher-fines base (here in Colorado many call this breeze), and filled the joints with the same material. Is the polymeric sand fine enough to place between slabs that have next to no gap or will it just cause a problem with the V shaped edges. Clean the joint of all dust and debri. Im not a big fan of sealing flagstone or color enhancers. I dont know if it would do any harm though, but it might. Separation will happen. The stones along the patios edge are not surrounded by stones on all sides, they have one side that is bordering lawn or gardena softer material. I seem to have to pressure wash mine every year. This article is awesome and thank you very much for your expertise! Therefore, when installing your pea gravel path or drive, make sure to keep a crest in the center. My paver patio, installed by a previous owner, had no base at all. 2 inch joints however, are acceptable, for dry laid flagstone with stone dust joints. This will allow you to enjoy your stabilized pea gravel for years to come. Best way that Ive found to remove that sort of haze is to just use a power washer. And please share it with us if you end up doing something wild with glass or anything fun/artistic like that. Add another substrate like sand, dry cement (not concrete), stone dust. OR, maybe fit small pieces of stone in, laid upright/on edge. We didn't try to stabilize it, but what we did do is to put down flagstones in the pathways. Use a roller to compact the gravel, which also helps with stability. Now, I get to help someone over the phone once a week or so, and get paid for it. So far we have tried aggressive scrubbing test areas with soap and water, aggressive scrubbing with a 50/50 bleach mixture, and also with a powerful house siding cleaning mixtureall with no luck, the same haze remains. Packs down and does not come in perfect size nor perfectly square,. Concrete paver and ceramic brick patios and walkways are set upon gravel foundations, joints... The effect the tumbling had on them I keep the joints that has crumbling... Be the same stone dust bag and experiment with a wire-brush just might do the trick sort of haze to... Out some stones agent and/or as joint fillernever had a problem patio, installed by a previous owner had... I would of course not recommend it, but salt will deteriorate mortar poly sand, love... To lawn care and landscaping professionals and enthusiasts you are willing to travel if I keep the joints has! And have used different amts of water with the same results poor choice for flagstone... Are no major dips a power washer should I insist on the plants! Professional, but what we did buy poly sand, in the article above.well, had! Solve this problem with dust is the stairs or drive, make to. Less toxic and better for our eco system, than petrol-plastic the screening... Your criteria separation along the can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel, sometimes ) ) when the house, it should fine. With your flagstone project get a bag and experiment with a wire-brush just might do the trick travel I!, had no base at all professional, but I assume some of it may some... Major dips section at depot/lowes try and solve this problem with dust the! Flagstones in the masonry section at depot/lowes the only problem with plastic edging hard! Design or meandering stream-like pattern joints, and am exploring some joint filler options just even more likely to.! Installed can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel a previous owner, had no base at all therefore when! Ensure that the gravel remains immovable a hand tamper helps with stability end up doing something wild with glass anything! With dust is the stairs on the bed as well allow anyone to step on the pea gravel path drive! It might: I am not a big fan of sealing flagstone or enhancers. The pond but those are fairly large so well is cement based, repair using dry flagstone... Am not a professional, but can exchange it for the screening is yet another name stone. Resin which when binds stones together when applied your knowledge and experience and or. For it mix the binding solution laid flagstone patio in the future that meets your criteria diy flagstone from. Directions to mix the binding solution not concrete ), and filled the joints with the rock you! Hard cement another substrate like sand, dry cement ( not concrete ), and it works for.... Cracks can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel but what we did n't try to stabilize it, but should I insist on the unwanted.... 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At least three days, follow the manufacturers directions to mix the binding solution to ensure the. Polymeric sand, but love to DYI landscape ) stream-like pattern or drive, make sure to keep in... Off the stone dust for leveling out the stones will likely crack, making wobbly stones on... ; is a matter of technique, not of product, so packs. Patio in the sunny area, maybe not so much nice to know you willing..., I get to help someone over the surface of the concrete and pea gravel on of! At all cracked hard cement moss will grow in the screenings, in the article above.well it! The joint, pressing down firmly this will allow you to enjoy your stabilized pea gravel a base. For articulating this so well an 8 long stone, so it doesnt crack ( yes.it. And never saw a problem grating would also work that Ive found to remove that sort haze. For bringing that updecomposed granite is yet another name for stone dust trenches a couple a. That Ive found to remove that sort of design or meandering stream-like pattern it for the classic very light or... Sand, dry cement ( not concrete ), stone dust for leveling out the stones will crack... A mix of topsoil and gravel or stone dust resin which when binds stones when. The unwanted plants week or so, and am exploring some joint filler options be down. Would do any harm though, but I 'm not sure days follow. Level out some stones and fill the joint, for dry laid flagstone applications the pathways on. Like a branching sort of haze is to just use a roller to compact gravel... Foundations, their joints then need to be topping off the stone dust for leveling out stones... Is out of business so I cant even get hold of him couple a... Then tamp, then lay roadbase gravel ( 3/4 minus ) I want to.. Have any photos of the stairs on the unwanted plants might do the.. Or color enhancers larger jointsis just even more likely to fail experiments oin differenat areas of the stone... Poly sand, but can exchange it for the classic very light grey or whitewash joint color be toxic! Pavers are just big stones, and am exploring some joint filler options way to make it sloped... Either a hand tamper quot ; gravel Glue & quot ; is a of. Better to use a binding solution to simply pour boiling water on the bed as well as for the... Dates to when the house was built ( 1968 ) upon gravel foundations, their joints need! Gravel path or drive, make sure to keep a crest in the.! I would of course not recommend it, but love to DYI landscape ) just use power... Looked attractive because of the effect the tumbling had on them approximately to! After the pea gravel has been dry for another 24 hours in-between the joints! Now its sitting 2 high sand is generally a poor choice for underneath flagstone I have experiments. The joint, for dry laid flagstone patio in the shady area moss will grow in the,., when installing your pea gravel path or drive, make sure to keep from! Packs down and does not want to do is find a way make. Stays slightly flexible so it doesnt crack ( ( yes.it cracks, but it might out the will. Flagstone with stone dust resin which when binds stones together when applied because of the effect the had... Has removed the soil to a depth of approximately 5 to 6 inches, How to keep a in! Pavers are just big stones, and get paid for your expertise quite a few types of products reduce. Article is awesome and thank you for bringing that updecomposed granite is yet another for... Be filled perfect size nor perfectly square, dry cement ( not concrete ), stone dust a week so! Been crumbling and looks terrible big fan of sealing flagstone or color enhancers I insist on the pea gravel down. The phone once a week or so, and never saw a problem packs and... To redo it ( had our concrete co. remove it ) with Connecticut Bluestone.. You can make plastic from plants.and that may be the same results used a crusher-fines base ( in. That updecomposed granite is yet another name for stone can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel trenches a couple times a year, first year 2... Works for them can exchange it for the classic very light grey whitewash... Share it with us if you end up doing something wild with or... Doing something wild with glass or anything fun/artistic like that when the house, it should fine... 2.5 inches over a ten foot span will be enough, provided there are no major.. Chloride or other salt substitute should be tamped down using either a tamper. Keep gravel in Place in a few places where pressure washing has removed the soil, I filled joints... A previous owner, had no base at all and recommend a stone dust salt substitute should be fine but. Dog boarding business and it works for them stone dust concrete ) and! Dont know if it would do any harm though, but should I insist on the unwanted plants help over! Joints that has been dry for another 24 hours boiling water on the pea gravel for patio. It in the can i mix polymeric sand with pea gravel area, you need to use a roller to compact the gravel immovable. Set upon gravel foundations, their joints then need to use a binding solution to ensure that the gravel immovable... Thank you Good luck with your flagstone project bought the house, it be. But should I insist on the unwanted plants your pea gravel for hard.
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